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This is because when the water is heated, it produces condensation that needs to be drained away. First, a barrier is formed between the combustion areas and the condensate pipe by the water. Maybe it was forgotten when maintenance was performed 9 months ago. Includes initial monthly payment and selected options. You must log in or register to reply here. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. A former Navien fan-boy he has installed hundreds of Naviens, but has pretty much given up on trying to get them to fix this. Because water vapor condenses inside the unit as the exhaust gas cools, condensing tankless water heaters require a drain (and potentially a pH neutralizer) to dispose of the acidic condensation water. JavaScript is disabled. It also means you can use inexpensive PVC pipe for venting. NPE 2 Condensing Tankless Water Heaters Navien NPE-2 High Efficiency Condensing Tankless Water Heaters NPE-A2 Series To clean the condensate trap, you will need to first shut off the power to the unit. After that, it flows to the condensate trap. But the water flowing out the condensate drain is continuous. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. We work hard to protect your security and privacy. We have fast FREE SHIPPING on all orders over $99 and ship all orders within 1 business day. The installer & distributor say the condensate will be 2 Gallons per hour (which seems to be the manufacturers maximum number). Each hour, a Navien boiler can produce up to 2 liters of condensation, otherwise termed boiler condensate. The condensate is taken out of the system through the wastewater outlet by using a condensate pipe. condensate drain for Navien tankless water heater, Plumbing Forum, Professional & DIY Advice, Navien NPE-240A - Temperature Fluctuations. It is a possibility that the heat exchanger is compromised and the leak cold be leaking burner side running out the conensate. Another key factor to consider is the quality of life. The PVC exhaust technology has made the installation easier. The condensate trap is designed to catch any water that condenses inside the unit. The unit is configured for scheduled recirculate times. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Naviens high efficiency and eco-friendly condensing technology can reduce energy consumption by 20% and significantly reduce greenhouse gas emissions.Navien condensing tankless water heaters and condensing boilers solve issues of reliability, durability, operating efficiency, energy and water conservation, installation and customer support for commercial applications throughout North America. TomCare Detachable Hose Holder- It is convenient to move and store if necessary. Contractors can save hours of installation by using economical PVC venting and Naviens new Ready-Link Rack system for wall or free standing mounting of multiple units. Take the cover off and you can see 2 translucent silicone hoses that connect from the small drain valves to the condensate drain line. In addition, the waters warmth can comfortably shift the ice if it starts to form. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Non-condensing tankless water heaters have a single heat exchanger and do not recycle heat from the exhaust gas. Acidic water can damage car paint and more. Because water vapor does not condense inside the unit, there is no drain required for installation. Some of it will condense on the heat exchanger. However, keep in mind that this liquid can corrode certain materials such as mental. Here are the website rules, as well as some tips for using this forum. At this point, the boiler will stop working automatically for safety reasons. The Condensate Neutralizer Kit can be used with Rinnai condensing boilers and tankless water heaters. You might also want to CAREFULLY take some very fine wire or a toothpick and try and clean out the weep hole. A lot of water continuously flows through the condensation line even the heat exchanger is not operating. Brief content visible, double tap to read full content. Our payment security system encrypts your information during transmission. Condensing boilers are made to utilize the heat created during the ignition process as well as the heat generated from the water vapor. A condensate pipe devoid of an auto-siphon may be shaped like a U.. When your Navien condensate trap leaking is making your boiler malfunction, the best solution is to call an expert and have it cleaned. If your Navien condensate trap is leaking, you will have to know the potential causes and fixes. JavaScript is disabled. Ultra high-efficiency tankless water heatersalso known as condensing tanklessuse two heat exchangers to supply endless hot water when you turn on a faucet. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? Plus, the installation instructions are clear and simple to understand for even the most inexperienced user. If you notice any condensation around the fitting, be sure to wipe it away and check the fitting for any blockages. There are several reasons why the water heater condensation occurs: The flue gases are cooled below their "dew point" when having the cold air supply. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. I changed it, but it now leaks from the condensation hose. We get it, but (1) terrylove.com can't live without ads, and (2) ad blockers can cause issues with videos and comments. Architects and commercial builders like the spacesaving design, flexibility in configurations. Post your model number so I can look up the schematic and exploded view. In general, in a string of multiplication is it better to multiply the big numbers or the small numbers first? Check out the deal on Navien 20006947A O-Ring P18 Black at TanklessParts.com, Check out the deal on Navien 30009933A O-Ring Kit at TanklessParts.com, Check out the deal on Navien 30008360A Check Valve for NPE Series at TanklessParts.com. To clean the condensate trap, you will need to first shut off the power to the unit. Sold by msflips and ships from Amazon Fulfillment. document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. A clogged drain can cause serious problems, including water damage to your home. Have a Navien NCB-210 that's been running well and Dana helped me tune last year. Watching this less than 2 minutes video will explain the reason and fix it. * Based on Energy Guide cost estimates using $1.09 per therm of natural gas. Hello recently my old 50gal gas water heater developed a crack and started leaking. Help others learn more about this product by uploading a video! Model Number Minimum Drain Size (inches) I've seen heat exchangers only leak under fire. Thanks. I have had the same issue with a lot of cold water coming out of the condensate drain. Low humidity environment does not reduce the condensate output of a condensing tankless water heater or combustion furnace. Learn how your comment data is processed. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. First off, Navien tech will provide support, even out of warranty. Water vapor is a byproduct of combustion, although, in this case, the vapor contains elements such as methane, nitrogen and oxygen. I figured at this point Id try and troubleshoot it myself. The trap is typically located near the bottom of the unit. A forum community dedicated to Do it yourself-ers and home improvement enthusiasts. The condensate is a combustion byproduct, and will be determined almost entirely by how much the heater runs - when the heater is running, expect pretty much the rated output. This item can be returned in its original condition for a full refund or replacement within 30 days of receipt. Condensing technology reduces energy consumption and greenhouse gas emissions. These extremely efficient and eco-friendly units provide extra energy savings over traditional tank and non-condensing tankless water heaters. Short story taking place on a toroidal planet or moon involving flying. Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! A lot of water continuously flows through the condensation line even the heat exchanger is not operating. Metal-based fittings cannot be used as the condensate itself is a bit acidic in nature and will corrode metal. When the heater is idle, expect none. Will this water heater be on or in an outside wall or will it be inside at the location of the current tank? Learn more about our products for home owners. Hope that helps someone. There was a problem adding this item to Cart. Yes, cold weather can affect your hot water heater. I bought a home a few months ago that had a Navien tankless water heater installed in 2019. Shipping cost, delivery date, and order total (including tax) shown at checkout. While a fairly quick and inexpensive job, this cannot be done by anyone except an expert. I also spoke to Navien and the tech there recommended condensate drains be 3/4 not 1/2. It looks like you're using an ad blocker. Can I gain AC efficiency by spraying condensate water on the outdoor coils? Is this excessive or normal? I used some brass parts I had laying around and picked up a $3.00 roll of clear tubing from the hardware store.I'll keep an eye on the brass fitting for signs of corrosion. If you have a tankless water heater, you know that one of the maintenance requirements is to occasionally check the condensate drain. Most technician said there might be a leak in the heat exchanger. Not an engineer, but it would seem what that weep hole is is actually a vacuum-breaker which should allow condensate to flow freely down the pipe. If you need to replace the condensate drain fitting, it is important to use a Navien-approved replacement. In general, there are two types of condensate traps ones that come with auto-siphons and ones that dont. Distilled water 7. Second, the trap controls the movement of condensate being expelled from the boiler. Your feedback is always appreciated. ComfortFlow includes a buffer tank, recirculation pump and fine-tuned controls which resolve the cold water sandwich effect and flow rate issues common in other tankless water heaters. This accessory perfect fit and extension to your dishwasher drain hose, will be needed if your appliance is more than the standard distance away from the house drain. The proven ultra-high-efficiency, eco-friendly, space-saving way to supply endless domestic hot water for homes and businesses. The only tool needed in the repair process is a screwdriver. Tankless water heaters have a condensate drain to properly drain the excess condensation produced by the second heat exchange unit installed inside of condensing tankless water heaters. I have a 3 year old Navien 240a tankless water heater. They are giving me the options to troubleshoot the unit for possibly $700 or more or to install a new one for about $5000. This condensation is actually good for the heat exchanger because it helps to keep it clean and free of scale. There was defintley some backpressure of some sort and the vent eliminated it. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Did you order it online or can I get it from a store? Most technician said there might be a leak in the heat exchanger. Different contractors? Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Navien condensing stainless steel heat exchangers recover extra heat that would be lost in non-condensing boilers. However, that also means that the volume of condensate coming down the pipe during each wave is higher, and you would notice leakages more. See our practical guide to Non-condensing Tankless Water Heaters. Would you be able to post a picture of the modification you've made to your Navien? However, proper maintenance is required in order to achieve this lifespan. Ships from and sold by SOUTH AVE EAST LLC. 1996-2023, Amazon.com, Inc. or its affiliates, Select a location to see product availability, 30003121A Navien Condensate Drain Hose BH2206006A. A malfunction in the boilers condensate trap will rarely damage your Navien boiler, but it will prevent it from working optimally. This seemingly insignificant part is capable of bringing your Navien boiler to its knees. I have a 3 year old Navien 240a tankless water heater. Once the trap is accessible, use a small brush or pipe cleaner to clean out any debris that may be blocking the trap. Spent a few minutes looking at mine. But, it if were clogged, why would condensate be leaking out of it? Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? Prices range from about $170 for small gas-fired units to more than $2,000 for high-output heaters that can supply two showers at the same time; $1,000 is about average. Mine is 1/2. This is a good option if you dont want to deal with the water inside your home. How to use Slater Type Orbitals as a basis functions in matrix method correctly? The Navien NPE-2 series is a line of high-efficiency condensing tankless water heaters featuring a user-friendly control panel. The 3 ft. tall drain standpipe affords the required air gap between the end of the drain and the level of the water in the P-trap. We are sorry. Not heating for period of time. In my area, the water is slightly alkaline and the city doesn't require condensate neutralizers. If you have a Navien tankless water heater, you know that its a great way to save space and energy. Replaced it and the problem was resolved. You should never run your Navien boiler without the condensate trap, as it stops noxious exhaust gases from moving down the condensate system. Is it possible to create a concave light? Thank you. February 2019 9-year-old Navien NR-240A, I recently started noticing constant flow out the condensate drain @ ~ 2gph when unit is fully off with no demand. It is important to keep this fitting clean and free of any debris, as it can clog and cause problems with the units operation. They said theyve never seen this problem before. Thank you very much for your help. Building owners or property managers appreciate the efficiency, reliability and durability of Navien tankless water heaters over outdated tank systems. Naviens standard ultra high-efficiency condensing tankless water heaters. This is necessary as noxious fumes need to be expelled through the flue instead of the condensate pipe. Blocked condensate traps are generally a result of not servicing your boiler for a long time. The condensate trap is designed to catch any water that condenses inside the unit. Non-condensing units have an efficiency rating of 0.81 UEF, which is still far more efficient than tank-style water heaters. I think an air gap of some sort is in order. Condensation inside Navien tankless water heater Heating Help: The Wall Home Domestic Hot Water Welcome! If you'd like to support the site, please allow ads. Please try again later. You talking about the inlet/outlet valve? Trying to understand how to get this basic Fourier Series. That means it cools the exhaust gas below the boiling point of water, thus causing most of the water vapor there to. Because the exhaust gas is very hot when it leaves the unit, metal concentric venting is required. Space-saving high-efficiency condensing boilers provide the ultimate heating and comfort experience. Navien Now Doing Business in Canada as Navien Canada, Inc. Navien Begins Shipping PeakFlowC Commercial Scale Prevention Systems. If your Navien tankless water heater is still not draining properly after cleaning the condensate trap, it may be due to a more serious issue. Water heaters located in the garage may terminate on the garage floor with the same distance requirements. I'm planning on piping it away from the heater closet (on outside of house). Non-condensing, older models would waste as much as 50% of the generated heat as the gases could escape through the flue. Called plumber over to take a look. But, as it is only a bit acidic, this poses no threat to health. To see our price, add these items to your cart. Difference between "select-editor" and "update-alternatives --config editor". Please try again. Thank you very much for your help. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. Ideal replacement part for most of air conditioner,the connector adapter to the air conditioner,the hose help drain out the wasted condensate water,the hose clamp adjust to fit, Reinforced Pool Discharge Hose With Various Sizes. But did you know that your Navien tankless water heater can also produce condensate? It only stops if I shut off the water valve. I replaced it with a tank-less gas heater. When a hot water tap is opened, the tankless water heater detects the flow, The flow sensor activates to determine the amount of hot water needed, The gas control valve opens to supply the correct amount of gas, The fan and venturi activate to provide the correct amount of gas and fuel, The premix burner ignites providing a flame to heat the water, Cold water is pre-heated in the secondary heat exchanger, Pre-heated water passes from the secondary to the primary heat exchanger, The unit determines outgoing set temperature and adjusts the flame to heat the water, Desired hot water amount delivered to the faucet. How do/should administrators estimate the cost of producing an online introductory mathematics class? Minimum inch T&P drain to terminate "outside" of the building no closer than 6 inches or further than 24 inches from grade. Water shouldn't be flowing continuously out of the condensation line, something is wrong somewhere. Not heating for long period of time. Water Heater (Tankless), Furnace, Chimney? If it were clogged, it might explain what was happening and what your video showed. This has a number of advantages, it's more efficient as it recovers the heat as the water condenses (heater is rated 93% efficient). If any particular ad is your REASON for blocking ads, please let us know. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Navien's products possess state-of-the-art technology, high efficiency and reliable quality. Test boiler water just for a baseline. If the condensate is coming from the exhaust, you can try to redirect it to a different location. When the heater is idle, expect none. Please make sure that you are posting in the form of a question. Think of the inconvenience is the boiler was located somewhere where you sleep or relax. So, did you find this article useful? How to perform annual maintenance on your Navien instantaneous water heater. When condensate pipes exist in regions where the cold can get rather extreme, leaking pipes pose an additional threat to the pipe. This part ensures that any condensation that forms on the unit is properly drained away, preventing any damage to the unit or your home. H2Air combination space heating and domestic hot water supply optional for NPE-A2 models. I used to run a small plumbing business near 875 Dawson DriveLouisville, KY 40202, and now I spend most of my time writing about my experiences. As you recommended, I hired a technician and he repaired it. I live in a desert area with a very low humidity (<15% normally) so 2 GPH seems excessive to me. If your Atwood water heater wont light, the first thing you should How Much Propane Does A Tankless Water Heater Use, Top 10 Best 80 Gallon Electric Water Heater (2022 Latest Price), Top 10 Best 20 Gallon Electric Water Heater For 2022 (Buying Guide), Best electric tankless water heater for rv. Advanced condensing tankless water heaters featuring Naviens patented ComfortFlow system. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. What Is A Condensate Line? What video game is Charlie playing in Poker Face S01E07? In Conclusion That means it cools the exhaust gas below the boiling point of water, thus causing most of the water vapor there to condense out to liquid. While models numbers may. Full text of the 'Sri Mahalakshmi Dhyanam & Stotram'. Navien WATER ADJUSTMENT VALVE, part 30008245A, for NPE-A model, Navien Flame Rod Assembly NPE NCB Series Part 30012226A, Forestchill Universal Flexible Drain Hose Water Pipe for Air Conditoner (20ft), MyLifeUNIT Washing Machine Drain Hose Extension Kit, Universal Fit All Drain Hose, 6-Foot, FangFarm 5/8" Outdoor Garden Hose with Water Stop, Hose Shut Off Valve, Flexible Water Hose, Durable and Leakproof, Solid Brass GHT Connector (20FT, Blue), Air Jade 3/5 Inch(15mm) Air Conditioner Drain Hose Connector Elbow Fitting with Rubber Ring, Universal Fit Mini-Split AC Unit and Window Air Conditioning Unit. Cooler exhaust means you have a wider range of venting material options, including PVC and polypropylene. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. A bit of the carbon dioxide generates during the ignition process mixes into the condensate, giving it its acidic nature. Boilers are susceptible to wear and tear over time like any other household appliance. Is it possible to rotate a window 90 degrees if it has the same length and width? link to Red Label Abrasives Vs. Some people like to sleep there and have long conversations. I bought a home a few months ago that had a Navien tankless water heater installed in 2019. Because the heat exchanger gets very hot, any water that comes into contact with it will instantly turn to steam. Why do many companies reject expired SSL certificates as bugs in bug bounties? Once you have the correct o-ring, you can install it yourself or have a professional do it for you. A lot of water continuously flow through the condensation line even the heat exchanger is not operating. Someone may be able to pick out the valves just by looking at it. If your Navien tankless water heater is not draining properly, it may be due to a clogged condensate trap. High-efficiency condensing and non-condensing tankless water heaters offer endless hot water and reduce gas usage. Today we have no hot water--the intake may read more EricK1229 Master Plumber Associate 213 satisfied customers Navien trouble. You may receive a partial or no refund on used, damaged or materially different returns. This water is then drained away, keeping your Navien water heater clean and free of any build-up. The floor beneath the unit was a little wet too but whatever caused that bit of moisture has seemed to have stopped. The boiler then detects that condensate cannot be expelled anymore and it shuts down. I have called Navien and several plumbers and it seemed like nobody had a clue what was going on. Visit https://heatinghelp.com/contact-us/. It may not display this or other websites correctly. You should check your o-ring regularly and replace it if necessary. Helping You to Do It Yourself! Over time, this water can build up and cause the trap to become clogged. Condensing tankless water heaters use a combination of two heat exchangers in the heating process. Efficient, durable and high-performance products for any commercial application. NPE-240S 1 Inside a condensing tankless water heater, the combustion process superheats the water that enters your shower, sink, etc. In one post with a similar issue, actually had to replace the 2 internal drain valve to fix the problem. The condensate line removes the moisture collected on the evaporator coil in your furnace or central air conditioner. But condensing units require a drain, which can limit your installation location options. This trap helps to prevent water from leaking out of the unit and onto your floor. Once the trap is clear, reattach the access panel and turn the power back on to the unit. Beyond that, some experimentation is likely called for. The condensate is a product of combustion of the hydrocarbon fuel: hydrocarbon + oxygen > carbon dioxide + water. Seems like the water here is very hard. Resources | Partners Login | Become an NSS |Certifications |Parts List | Technical Support | Careers |Global Network |Warranty, All contents copyright Navien Inc. | About Navien |Contact Us | Terms of Use |Privacy Policy |CCPA |Notices, Ultra-high efficiency condensing tankless water heaters, High efficiency non-condensing tankless water heaters. First-time installation costs run more than a simple tank replacement. If you have a Navien tankless water heater, you know that its a great way to have hot water on demand. Full content visible, double tap to read brief content. The temperature of flue gases decreases rapidly during this process, going down to 50 from 130. We have had another plumbing issue with a leaky tub faucet. Error posting question. Please try again. If you have any questions about your Navien water heater, or if you need help troubleshooting a problem, be sure to contact a qualified technician. The leak can only be stopped when I close the cold water inlet. Firstly, problems associated with any condensate system element are usually minor. When the water temperature inside the tank drops below 110 F. Once the water inside the tank is heated above 115 F, condensation should stop. If so, where can I purchase one? Protect your water supply and your water heating equipment with eco-friendly water treatment solutions. A condensate trap may get blocked over time due to debris accumulation. Thanks. Okay to use cold water drain valve on tankless gas water heater as a spigot? Can the condensation line (using a condensate pump) of a basement hybrid water heater be connected to a waste line directly above the water heater? Though, they really want to talk to a plumber familiar with the units, even unregistered. a global leader in high efficiency water heaters and boilers. If you have a Navien tankless water heater, you know that one of the most important parts of the unit is the condensate trap. The leak can only be stopped when I close the cold water inlet. The unit is designed to heat water on demand, so there is no need to store hot water in a tank. They were not helpful. Does anyone have any perspective on likely actual condensate volume? Condensing combi-boilers deliver high-efficiency endless hot water and space heating in one compact unit. The heat exchanger is the part of the tankless water heater that actually heats the water. The ultimate in energy efficiency. Condensing tankless water heaters need a condensate drain. Navien OEM O-Rings. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese. Doesn't analytically integrate sensibly let alone correctly. Navien Condensate Trap Leaking: Reasons And Troubleshooting. A drop in temperature makes the gases condense.